Author Topic: Are you or is your GM generous ?  (Read 2000 times)

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Offline Dragonking11

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Are you or is your GM generous ?
« on: August 12, 2017, 11:27:28 AM »
As a GM I always thought that every reward given to players should be hard earned.

Often players would try to "bribe" me out of game in order to find some relic specifically tailored to their characters. I knew they would be so happy if I flinched and gave them their loot but I always thought that it would be bad in the long term as the campaign progresses.

Thus I consider myself a very strict GM.

What about you guys ?

Offline Druss_the_Legend

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Re: Are you or is your GM generous ?
« Reply #1 on: August 12, 2017, 03:45:07 PM »
As a GM I always thought that every reward given to players should be hard earned.

Often players would try to "bribe" me out of game in order to find some relic specifically tailored to their characters. I knew they would be so happy if I flinched and gave them their loot but I always thought that it would be bad in the long term as the campaign progresses.

Thus I consider myself a very strict GM.

What about you guys ?

i walk a line. im not a hardass but i am firm with cause and effect. eg. murder creates a ripple effect that will over time catch up with them via the story/actions of other pcs who knew/were related to the npc murdered. i am also a stickler for play balance. i have a few players who always try to push things a little when it comes for getting a little more out of the rules. i gather their feedback from any rules changes i make, giving them input into the changes before i decide if ill go ahead with the, this helps me decide if they need tweeks b4 adding them to the campaign. we have a long break of 10 months in between seasons (a season consists of 8-10 playing sessions) so this gives me and them plenty of time to hash thing out in preparation for the coming season. For example i have added new weapon abilities which are a bit like Innate Stat abilities that players may select for their character when they reach a high enough skill rank (12+). I am also allow talents and the flaws that balance them to be developed beyond level 1. I think they key thing here is to give your players advanced warning and let them has some input.

Offline Dragonking11

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Re: Are you or is your GM generous ?
« Reply #2 on: August 12, 2017, 06:40:34 PM »
I think you may be right that communication with the players is the key

I'm curious about your season play. Why do you have so much time between your play sessions ?

Offline intothatdarkness

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Re: Are you or is your GM generous ?
« Reply #3 on: August 12, 2017, 08:19:41 PM »
For me it depends on the desired storyline. In some cases I have done relics tailored for PCs, but it was to advance a specific plot line. But it was always something I designed and not something players brought to me. I also do a fair amount of non-fantasy gaming, so that kind of stuff isn't necessarily relevant.
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Offline Druss_the_Legend

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Re: Are you or is your GM generous ?
« Reply #4 on: August 12, 2017, 08:32:39 PM »
I think you may be right that communication with the players is the key

I'm curious about your season play. Why do you have so much time between your play sessions ?

its the summer break i get. i have 5wks holiday so a good length of time to plan sessions and play them we play oniline using roll20 in the evenings so in my campaign we will play 2x week over 5wks. there is lost of chat online in between live games too so we r really immersed in the campaign for those 5wks. i think if we played face-to face wed meet monthly or so but for now this works.

Offline Witchking20k

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Re: Are you or is your GM generous ?
« Reply #5 on: August 13, 2017, 07:08:51 AM »
I use random treasure as a rule.  If I give an item to a player its always necessary for or tied to the story. 
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Offline Dragonking11

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Re: Are you or is your GM generous ?
« Reply #6 on: August 13, 2017, 07:29:34 AM »
I use random treasure as a rule.  If I give an item to a player its always necessary for or tied to the story. 

I'm the same actually. Its only that I don't like giving to much power to quickly to players. I try to keep a firm grip on the power level and scope of the story. I always thought that this leaves me room to increase them more easily why its needed (or when I feel like it  ::) )

Offline Peter R

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Re: Are you or is your GM generous ?
« Reply #7 on: August 13, 2017, 10:51:51 AM »
Every permanent magic item in my game is significant to the story and they are rare. I do encourage players to make the best use of their spells though and this encourages people to reuse rune paper and to create potions or use symbol ways to create enchantment.
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Offline Dragonking11

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Re: Are you or is your GM generous ?
« Reply #8 on: August 13, 2017, 09:07:52 PM »
Every permanent magic item in my game is significant to the story and they are rare. I do encourage players to make the best use of their spells though and this encourages people to reuse rune paper and to create potions or use symbol ways to create enchantment.

I always was unsure how to handle the runes or symbols in my games. They are really useful when available but I find it hard to incorporate in my sessions beside just telling my players when they are in town "ok guys you just created 5 runes as you are in no rush what-so-ever"

So I generally do not advertise them or give them as rewards

How do you handle it ?

Offline Peter R

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Re: Are you or is your GM generous ?
« Reply #9 on: August 14, 2017, 02:18:42 AM »
I tend not to hand wave great periods of time so the players have to pick their moment when they are going to expend the power points to create the runes as they can be demanding. The players tend to tell me what they want to create each day and when they are going to do it.

I certainly do not stop them doing it but then I don't give away spell adders and spell multipliers so the runes do extend the operational range of the spell casters. It also gives them more of their lower level spells rather than more of their high level spells which is what spell bonus items tend to do.

Runes also tend to require more fore thought. If the characters are about to set off on a major quest then and are going to do all the prep they can then I will happily let them prepare all the runes they need. Of course that then involves them planning what runes they need.

Rune paper and potions are easily removed from the game if you find they are effecting the power level. The potions are single use and the vials are vulnerable during falls or even krush criticals to the area they are being carried. Runes are vulnerable to fire and water events.

My players are currently carrying a rune of life giving. My players know it exists because I do not pull any punches when fatal criticals come up. The characters are being sponsored by a church and the party is lead by a PC cleric of that religion so the scroll is not totally out of the question to be given to a first level party; as they were at the beginning. They are now 5th level and have not needed it, yet.

I find that most of the runes the characters make are not used most of the time. The players had expectations or planned contingencies when they made the runes but those situations either did not arise or when they did it was more practical to use power points of they simply forget they have the rune prepared.

On the other hand I have pushed the characters to the point where they have been totally dependent on a few remaining low level spells cast from runes, often to protect a dwindling number of power points for a final battle.

Over all I find them to be a positive addition to the campaign.
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Offline Dragonking11

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Re: Are you or is your GM generous ?
« Reply #10 on: August 14, 2017, 08:45:26 AM »
Very useful insight and point of view

I will remember this in the future when the situation arise !

Offline Spectre771

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Re: Are you or is your GM generous ?
« Reply #11 on: August 22, 2017, 07:53:23 AM »
I've played for both types of GM's and I try to find the line to walk when I GM.  It's not that fine of a line really, but I do have to balance.


On the one side of the coin, the generous GM awarded my PC a level 50 Battle-axe of Armour Slaying (C&T1 I believe) in my first campaign ever playing RM2.  All armour must make RR vs. lvl 50 or be destroyed. All subsequent hits were vs. AT 1 since they no longer had armour.  If they had a shield, the shield was affected first, then the armour, then AT 1.  Given that all of our PC's started at level 5, it was essentially handing an level 1 player a level 50 weapon.    We raided a heavily defended fortification and the Lord was a high level NPC with a large weapon cache.  The reward was fitting of the risk, but the GM admitted to "... just love the weapon.  It looked awesome."    Another PC received a Battle Totem that negated all rounds of stun, another fantastic item!  My PC went through slaughtering NPC's from that point on.  That came back to haunt him (and the other GMs) in all following sessions though.  The GMs ended up hating my PC and tried to find other treasures to coax me away from using the Battle-axe.  Combat scenarios were tailored directly against my PC; close quarter combat, restricted area combat, "honorable combat with board and sword", ranged combat where I needed to use a shield to live, multiple foes to make parrying nigh impossible for me, etc.

On the other side of the coin, the less-than-generous GM would send us through wonderfully crafted campaigns, great and colourful sessions and "... everyone gets 5000xp and 300 Gold."  Ummmm... what????  Session after session of mundane treasure, everyone gets the same amount of XP and gold?  It came to the point where we didn't care what we did, we knew we were all getting the same flat level reward.

Every permanent magic item in my game is significant to the story and they are rare. I do encourage players to make the best use of their spells though and this encourages people to reuse rune paper and to create potions or use symbol ways to create enchantment.

I like to do this as well.  I look at what my players have as equipment, their credo, or the backstory is.  I try to think up items that would be really cool for their PC.  If one player has Falchion or Scimitar, I make the bad guy have a really nice, magical Scimitar.  If the PC has non-magical armour, I'll make sure that another challenging battle will have the baddie wearing magical armour of the same or better AT.  For a grand campaign, I make sure there is something worthwhile for each PC that would make them happy they chose to go on the adventure.  I try to keep the level within 5 levels of the PC.  Unlike a level 5 PC with a level 50 weapon.  Don't get me wrong... I LOVE LOVE LOVE the Battle-axe, but I've started to choose other weapons from my arsenal just to make the game more fun for other players and a little easier for the GM.  The really good magical items +15 or more, are very rare to find, PP Multipliers even more so.  I try to look at what future campaigns will be like and how the balance can be thrown off for me or other GMs.  The fun for me as a player really started to wane when the GM's were announcing that they had to work the campaigns against my PC "... because of that damned axe!"  You think the gods are against you?  Try having the GMs against you!  :(

I use random treasure as a rule.  If I give an item to a player its always necessary for or tied to the story. 

I also make moderate use of this as well.  I believe C&T I + II have the random treasure charts.  I'll roll on these charts when I'm designing the campaign and I get ideas from the items that roll up.  I'll look at the players and tweak the item as needed.  If I roll for a Level 2 Essence item, but all of the players are Channeling or Mentalism, I'll switch the realm.  Or, if I can think of a good situation where they can trade that item off as a bargaining chip, I'll leave it as is.  If I roll +10 AT 20, but I know all of my players are leather and chain, I'll make it a chain item.  I'll also use that random treasure chart for the minor skirmishes that occur during normal course of gameplay.
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Offline Dragonking11

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Re: Are you or is your GM generous ?
« Reply #12 on: August 22, 2017, 10:22:48 AM »
It seems you played with both extreme  ;D

I agree that it is sometimes a thin line to walk on. Being too generous raises the scope so high that it becomes impossible to balance afterwards and people get bored easily. The same is true for the other extreme of never getting anything of value.

I also think that trying to give loot tailored to each PCs is the best approach. Of course, giving an ultimate Battle-Axe of Gods Slaying to a first level character was probably too much  ;)

Offline Spectre771

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Re: Are you or is your GM generous ?
« Reply #13 on: August 22, 2017, 11:58:46 AM »
Of course, giving an ultimate Battle-Axe of Gods Slaying to a first level character was probably too much  ;)

Yes, it definitely was.  In his defense, he was level 5 but all of our players start at level 5... so still essentially a level 1-type PC.  I happened to be the only player who used Battle-axe so the GM jumped at the chance to award it.


Oh the look on other GM's faces the first time I told them their baddie had to make a RR for their armour or it was destroyed.  Even funnier when I said "... versus level 50"   ;D
If discretion is the better valor and
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Offline Peter R

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Re: Are you or is your GM generous ?
« Reply #14 on: August 23, 2017, 08:11:54 AM »
I played a thief for a few years in Shadow World. The character was originally a pre-gen and the GM had taken characters from Heroes and Rogues and made a few changes. He had also made some unusual weapon choices to encourage people away from sword and board.

My character had thrown dagger as their primary weapon skill. This GM also had a tendency to put all the bad guys in plate armour. This meant that even on an open ended roll made in heaven I was limited to doing something like 3C in damage.

To mitigate this somewhat I concentrated on Adrenal Move Speed and Two Weapon Combo and started to learn thrown dagger in the off hand. At least now I had 4 chances to get a critical and could get a stun result.

Obviously it takes a while to build us these skills so I really struggled for several levels. The GM seeing that he had intended my character to be the secondary fighter in the group but I was really having issues in combat thought he would give me a helping hand. He gave out a set of throwing daggers that long doored back to the thrower at the end of each round, were +30 and hit using the broadsword table.

These seemed awesome initially but he gave them to me just about as my investment in Adr.Speed and TWC was really kicking in and I was starting to make those skill rolls at most attempts. There was almost nothing that could stand against me and by contrast the fighter normally arrived at the fight just after everyone was dead. The GM also gave out individual EXP so I was gaining most of the combat exp. I soon caught up the levels I was lagging behind and then over took everyone. In the end I spoke to the GM as these daggers were simply too powerful. With them the character was over powered but without them the character was not really viable because so many levels of investment had gone into trying to mitigate against such a weak offence. In the end we killed the character off and I started in the group with a different PC.

The moral of the story is to be very careful with the most powerful magic items, who you give them to and how you can take them away again should you have to.
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Spectre771 A couple of weeks ago, I disemboweled one of my PCs with a...