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Author Topic: In the House of Ecthelion  (Read 7440 times)

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Offline yammahoper

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Re: In the House of Ecthelion
« Reply #20 on: October 24, 2010, 05:52:35 PM »
I have done the rapid dev of ranks before.  Worked fine.

Now back to that fountain you're suppossed to be defending!
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser gate. All those moments will be lost in time... like tears in rain... Time to die.

Offline Marc R

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Re: In the House of Ecthelion
« Reply #21 on: October 24, 2010, 06:14:39 PM »
Does this mean a character reaching 10th level character could mass purchase 22 ranks of a skill with an X/Y cost?
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Offline Ecthelion

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Re: In the House of Ecthelion
« Reply #22 on: October 25, 2010, 12:53:43 AM »
Does this mean a character reaching 10th level character could mass purchase 22 ranks of a skill with an X/Y cost?
20 ranks in most cases to be precise (level x 1 for a skill you can develop at max. 1 rank per level, level x 2 for a skill you can develop with max. 2 ranks per level etc.).

Offline yammahoper

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Re: In the House of Ecthelion
« Reply #23 on: October 25, 2010, 09:26:51 AM »
20 ranks.  adolescence being long gone, lol.  this sort of rule provides yet another advantage to being high(er) level, which can be good and bad.  it is best to throw in some roleplay mechanics, such as a teacher or instructor or time training/studying/etc.  I pull out the training table in RMSS and figure how many hours it takes to acquire the skill ranks, and if it is going to be a significant amount of time, the PC can use the skill at whatever skill rank currently possed as time passes (i.e. in three days he has two ranks in demon  lore and is called opun to make a skill check...three game weeks later he is at 9 skill ranks and called upon to make another demon lore skill check...after 12 weeks of reading and study and instruction, the PC has reached his 20 ranks).

I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser gate. All those moments will be lost in time... like tears in rain... Time to die.

Offline providence13

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Re: In the House of Ecthelion
« Reply #24 on: October 25, 2010, 07:50:13 PM »
It's great to read how other people game. Conditions are different at every table but I always learn something new.

Press and Melee Attack:
I think I understand what you're  to get at here, and it makes some sense. What works for your group is best! IMHO, OB could also play a big role in the ability to move opponents back, against their will.

Perhaps a massive foe would add to an Influence (Combat) roll, forcing the defender to make an RR or be moved back 10'. Maybe 1'/10 they failed the RR. Their MM would be at least a level Diff higher, unless they are using some %Act to look behind them.

Yet a truly talented attacker, might make a NPC believe that there is more OB coming their way. The flurry of blows disorients the defender, they become frantic and believe that they are just moving around for a better defensive position while they are actually being led by the attacker.

When I read about multiple attackers combining weight to drive back a foe, I thought of the Three Musketeers. I've always seen them portrayed as slim (except for one, iirc) yet their skill was sufficient that one Musketeer could drive back multiple opponents.
Perhaps that slender wood elf has an OB high enough to overcome the weight bonus of the troll.
I like the reasons for the House Rule changes, thanks for including those.
"The Lore spell assaults your senses- Roll on the spontaneous human combustion table; twice!"

Offline Marc R

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Re: In the House of Ecthelion
« Reply #25 on: October 25, 2010, 08:33:40 PM »
I've never been really happy with the idea that even under intense training, with masters, under ideal circumstances, you couldn't gain a bunch of ranks in an ability. . .but part of me shies from the idea of someone 9th level, but unskilled in unarmed fighting getting into a barfight with a 5th level brawler and getting embarrassingly beaten up, leaving, purchasing 20 ranks of Martial Arts while working out in a gym for a week, then coming back to beat the crap out of the brawler with a stunning display of master level skill.

I do totally get the logic of not being limited to 1 or 2 ranks, for a lot of reasons, but something about learning 20 ranks in one level just seems wrong. . .I admit that often that won't be an issue, since usually players won't choose to do so, but not putting a per level limit in place means you literally, if you happen to be at a level cusp, go from -25 total ignorance bonus to a respectable to high bonus in the metaphorical blink of an eye, which seems kinda crazy. . . .I might be cool with the idea if a PC spends a year or more in intense training to get there, so our hypothetical 9th level above makes 10th, spends a year in intensive martial arts training with masters, comes back and beats the tar out of the bar bully, that makes sense. . .but not unskilled-click-level-master.

It's your house rule, so it must work for you, but it's definitely been an issue I've struggled with at my table, so I'm interested to hear your view on that overly quick upgrade angle.
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Offline yammahoper

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Re: In the House of Ecthelion
« Reply #26 on: October 25, 2010, 09:39:48 PM »
Pull out the training table from RMSS and you will see it isn't exactly over night to reach 8 ranks let alone 20.

You can also increase the definition of hours training to equal one day beyond the core rule progression the table already uses (in fact the table notes clearly point this out).

Another option I have used is to have one days training (as defined by the table/rank beibg learned) provides 3 dp.  This prevents traing from being equal for all skills. 
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser gate. All those moments will be lost in time... like tears in rain... Time to die.

Offline Marc R

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Re: In the House of Ecthelion
« Reply #27 on: October 25, 2010, 09:59:45 PM »
Well, cost would already limit ranks per level directly, if a character purchases 20 ranks in a 20 DP/rank skill, evidently they're getting a lot more DP/level than I'm using. A skill will rapidly price itself out of 10 or 20 ranks in one level.

Even at 3dp/day, assuming your MA cost was 2, you could get your but kicked, walk to a dojo, train for two weeks, take your 20 rank worthy black belt, and go back and beat the tar out of the other guy. . .which seems like a rather brief span to go from bar rag to black belt.

I read the document on Ecth's site above, and I didn't see a training time limitation (or any limitation), hence my asking the question.
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Offline yammahoper

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Re: In the House of Ecthelion
« Reply #28 on: October 25, 2010, 10:48:04 PM »
two weeks would be a brief span!

The table in rmss increases the time required to train as the ranks increase.  Base rate is 8 hrs training equals a day, with an additional 8 hours added every 2 ranks (1-2 ranks 8 hrs, 3-4 ranks 16 hours peer rank, 5-6 24 hours per rank, etc).

iirc that is.  sigh.  not running rm right now, and sm game is over, instead im GMing a DnD 3.5 game.  i know, i know...but I have several ideas how to slip in some RM and HERO (evil GM laugh).  It starts with some universe/plane jumping...
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser gate. All those moments will be lost in time... like tears in rain... Time to die.

Offline Marc R

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Re: In the House of Ecthelion
« Reply #29 on: October 25, 2010, 10:57:50 PM »
ahh, so
1 rank takes 1 day
5 ranks takes 15 days
10 takes 50 days
15 ranks takes 120 days
20 ranks takes 200 days

Which is a lot of days to take off from adventuring with the party ("See you guys in 10 sessions or so!")

Do you recall which book that's in?
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Offline Ecthelion

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Re: In the House of Ecthelion
« Reply #30 on: October 26, 2010, 05:29:05 AM »
I've never been really happy with the idea that even under intense training, with masters, under ideal circumstances, you couldn't gain a bunch of ranks in an ability. . .but part of me shies from the idea of someone 9th level, but unskilled in unarmed fighting getting into a barfight with a 5th level brawler and getting embarrassingly beaten up, leaving, purchasing 20 ranks of Martial Arts while working out in a gym for a week, then coming back to beat the crap out of the brawler with a stunning display of master level skill.
a) These are the house rules of our group. You are free to adapt them to your game.
b) With a cost of 3/5 for a Fighter developing 20 ranks when reaching level 10 would cost 80 DPs for the skill alone, with no rank in the skill category. That alone puts a limit on what you can learn.

Offline Marc R

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Re: In the House of Ecthelion
« Reply #31 on: October 26, 2010, 07:17:18 AM »
True, I'd kind of ignored the Y of an X/Y cost, so you're not going to get X cost x20 unless you're 20th level, in my example above you'd get X x 10 + Y x 10 = final cost.

OK thanks, that was an angle I'd never considered, and I'll need to think about it.
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Offline Ecthelion

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Re: In the House of Ecthelion
« Reply #32 on: February 16, 2011, 09:54:27 AM »
I have again added a few new rules to the document:
- Increasing damage via Spell Mastery: we require -50 skill modification per damage increment vs. the -20, -30 etc. from the official rules.
- Penalty for using Martial Arts with a useless arm: we also apply the -20 when holding a large object in hand
- Weaker Martial Arts attacks: we use a special attack table, derived from the RM2 "Armored Fist" attack table, for MA attacks. This table is much weaker than the official MA attack table.

As always you can find the House Rules document on my homepage.

Offline Marc R

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Re: In the House of Ecthelion
« Reply #33 on: February 19, 2011, 09:28:57 AM »
When we played "historic" games, for realistic bare hand attacks we just capped at rank/tier II for all MA. . .keeping the armored fist table for use with gauntlets or heavy boots.
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Offline Ecthelion

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Re: In the House of Ecthelion
« Reply #34 on: April 04, 2015, 10:39:40 AM »
We have again added some new house rules:
- Changed the handling of bonus helmets
- Toned down the herb Splayfoot to last only D4 minutes instead of D4 hours
- Some changes to the parrying rules for two-handed weapons in conjunction with a shield

The full document with the changes can be found on my homepage.

Offline yammahoper

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Re: In the House of Ecthelion
« Reply #35 on: April 05, 2015, 05:39:22 PM »
I thought you died at the fall of Gondolin? How can you be making new rules?
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser gate. All those moments will be lost in time... like tears in rain... Time to die.

Offline Ecthelion

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Re: In the House of Ecthelion
« Reply #36 on: April 06, 2015, 03:14:26 AM »
I thought you died at the fall of Gondolin? How can you be making new rules?
"Revived", just like Glorfindel  ;).

Offline Ecthelion

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Re: In the House of Ecthelion
« Reply #37 on: September 03, 2016, 05:08:29 PM »
After quite some time we again updated our Rolemaster House Rules and added a rule bringing more flexibility for bastard weapons plus we added dedicated attack tables for the bastard sword and the bastard axe. These attack tables are more in line with the original Arms Law, whereas we think that the new Bastard Sword/-Axe table from The Armory is much too weak. In fact a two-handed Bastard Sword there is as only powerful as a (one-handed) Falchion and one-handed the weapon is then a -15 Falchion, which IMO renders the weapon quite useless.

The rules can be found via my homepage link or directly here.

 

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