Topic: Solutions to Absolution

[Old Man]

If I'm not mistaken, the pure severs the body from the soul permenantly, so there's no lingering effect to dispell. (i.e. it kills you, at least in terms of the body has no soul now.)

Dark Absolution destroys the soul, so nothing fixes that short of GM intervention. (There's no spell I can think of at least. perhaps one of the "over 50th level" spells from a companion?)

No spell but I could see, perhaps, a version of the 75th level New Body called New Soul. Grab a ton of spirit stuff, put in blender, hit "frappe" and put in the soulless body... Not the same person tho...

Ciao,
Old Man

[Old Man]

...
My problem with the Absolution = injury explaination, which means the spell first permenantly injures you by tearing out your soul, then heals you later by restoring it at the end of the duration, is that if you chose to define it that way. . . .referring back to the rule above on cancels. . . .is that during the seperated soul and body duration, the evil cleric says "Fine, I cancel it". . . .and now you're dead. . .or at least, the soul will not be coming back, since the second half effect hasn't gone off. . . .I prefer to think of the soul removal as the only effect, that since you're not dead, your soul naturally wants to return to the body, so as soon as the effect wears off you snap back. . .
...

I wouldn't allow the caster to cancel it either... Can't cancel the fireball once it detonates. I am using that sort of logic.

Ciao,
Old Man

[Rasyr-Mjolnir]

I won't say that Razyr. That difference seems more profound to me. Let's say the soul is connected to the body via a 'silver rope', the Absolution tear the soul out of its vessel but doesn't damage the 'rope' beyond a mere straining.
OTOH, Pure Absolution severs the rope. The two spells don't seem to work the same way, unless you consider that Pure absolution is simply a mightier version of Absolution giving the soul a stronger shove, strong enough to cur the rope ?

The silver cord? That is a setting/cosmology issue, not a system/rules issue. My comments on the differences between the 2 versions of Absolution (not referring to Dark Absolution) were system/rules oriented.

[Balhirath]

Hmm Sustain Body (Closed Essence ) from Spell Users have a 20th level spell called Maintain Soul. Which for 10minutes/level makes the spellcaster immune to "Absolution or similar spells which attempt to seperate the casters soul from the body."

Quite usefull here, though I dont know the level of the party

You might think of making a lesser version, that gives a bonus to resistance rolls instead and then make a potion/rune out of it.

[Arioch]

Actually that did come up in game play.  The character was absolved and perfectly fine having an ale with his god until he felt the tug of lifegiving and his god said 'sorry but you've gotta go'.

But back to the question of 'where souls go' is that if they do not go to the Elysium Fields or wherever then the spell is much more limited in scope. 

This is also very setting specific... the spell states that the character's soul is sent to whatever is planned for the afterlife. It doesn't say nothing about his awareness, if in a setting mind and soul are two separate things then the problem of "where souls go" it's more limited IMHO.

[TomOBedlam]

This sounds like a GM dependent call.
I would rule it like
"The spell pulls your soul out, and places it in the realm of death belonging to the caster. It will take your soul 1 week/10 fail to find its way back"
i.e dispelling would do nothing at all.

As a GM I would also allow spritual care to lure the spirit back faster. Things like burning the targets favourite food/drink, having virgins sing around him... Stuff like that. Depending on his culture/religion of cause.

[Fornitus]

If the pc is absolved by a dark gods power then why would'nt the soul go into captivity in a version or the dark gods domain. That's what keeps the soul away that long. they are imprisioned.

This alows a interesting "medaphore" session as the pc's fight and try to escape this new hell.(where they cant die beacuse they are already dead. But pain on the other hand......)

Now , if only all the pc's, or all but 1, accidentily got absolved then the party would be together.....

Isint it convienent that the death of the final devote sets off a dark pack/contingency of retribution on behalf of the dark god affecting all within the temple for destroying his cult as a final act. This would be a ritualized spell set up long ago with the formation of the cult of course and of enough lvl to be aproprate.

just an idea

[Fidoric]

The silver cord? That is a setting/cosmology issue, not a system/rules issue. My comments on the differences between the 2 versions of Absolution (not referring to Dark Absolution) were system/rules oriented.

Sure Razyr, it's very setting oriented. IMO any question dealing with such a thing as soul as to be so... It's one of the point where the rules must be set according to the setting. One of the real good thing you keep on advising. 

[Arioch]

Isint it convienent that the death of the final devote sets off a dark pack/contingency of retribution on behalf of the dark god affecting all within the temple for destroying his cult as a final act. This would be a ritualized spell set up long ago with the formation of the cult of course and of enough lvl to be aproprate.

A very nasty idea... perhaps it could be keyed to an item of some sort, when the item is activated it releases a wave of Unholy energy that absolve everything in a given readius... 

[Fornitus]

Either way you can run all the party (or all but the one caring for the bodies) in a little mini-hell campaign. The better they do the faster they return.

[Marc R]

I find trips to hell either brief, deadly, or well prepared for in RM.  . .. .(or both brief and deadly.)

[ictus]

even when well prepared they can be brief and deadly

-poor Tarsil I remember him well...

[Fornitus]

Ah...

But their not there in "BODY" at all...

Just their imortal soul   

[Marc R]

Either way, not a really a picnic or a walk in the park.

[Fornitus]

LM- casting Lifekeeping was brought up to "help" reist Absoulition but as TomOBedlam pointed out in another thread it looks like maybe it wont take unless the target is "dead" so no benifit for a living character.

Any Ruling anywhere on casting Lifekeeping on the living that you know of?

[Marc R]

There's a spell that will keep you in suspended animation if you're killed. . .my brain is saying paladin list from roco1.

Self Keeping, 17th level spell.

I dunno if that would affect either an absolution or Dark Absolution. . .mostly seems intended to prevent normal soul departure due to death, the only advantage over lifekeeping is that it's cast pre-emptively.

[Fornitus]

So the regular Lifekeeping can't be cast pre-emptivily?

[mocking bird]

So the regular Lifekeeping can't be cast pre-emptivily?

That is interesting.  If you allow lifekeeping as a pre-emptive defense against absolution, it would then also work for normal soul departure due to death due to damage.  For example why not cast is before heading into combat for for the higher level ones once a week or month even?

[Marc R]

Self keeping is a roco1 spell, so it's not canon, but I don't read lifekeeping as being allowed to be used pre-emptively even without that contrast.

[yammahoper]

There is a self keeping spell on Self Healing, open mentalism...and on monk base...IIRC.

So many books...brain getting fuzzy with age...and lack of playing :'(

lynn